America has gone soft!

[zachc]

Ok guys and gals, I'm watching the news and I have to ask, When is enough enough? It seems like every night I watch the news I hear another case of a parent (mother and/or father) killing or seriously hurting their kids. Well that's besides all of the shootings that take place every day. Now I may or may not work in the law enforcement field but I can tell you for a FACT that these "adults" that are doing this, are not living hard in Ohio prisons! Don't get me wrong, I am very proud to be an American and served in the USMC but wow American government when is enough enough! Stop "sentencing" these people to a life of ease in prison (Ohio), hold them accountable for their actions! If you ask me I am all about an eye for an eye. These people want to stab, beat, drown their kids, well here it comes right back at you! Instead they sentence them to life in prison...where they get TVs, more programs than you can imagine, 3 hot meals a day, FREE utilities, phone calls and visits, and if they want illegal drugs and cell phones and weapons, "rights" to certain things (x amount of showers a week, x amount of recreation time a week, and the list goes on), no accountability if they don't get a job while they're incarcerated they still get paid money from the state to buy "hygiene items", oh yeah now they get emails, and they can video visit (like Skype), miniature tablets, send and receive video messages, the same food we buy but cheaper, video games (limited hand held/TV hook up type), etc. I don't know about you but if I don't work I don't get any of that stuff. All of the things that I just mentioned are all literally what Ohio inmates receive! Look into it. Murders, rapists, child molesters, doesn't matter. Now aside from getting in the occassional fight here and there does that really seem like a hard life? There is so much that goes on behind prison walls that the public is unaware of that its CRAZY. The only thing the public usually sees is when law enforcement in general uses "excessive force" but when inmates assault the law enforcement officers when do you hear about that? Very very rarely! Don't get me wrong, there is a fine line between excessive force and enough force used to control the situation and wrong is wrong regardless. So anyways, if your still reading this post, lol, thats my rant and rave. As long as the government, state or country, keeps treating these people so humanely (because they treated their victims so humanely right?) and not really punishing them and holding them accountable for their actions, people in society are going to continue to do these kind of things. Come on people let's just call a spade a spade... Ok know I feel a little better!

[Big_Holla]

Oh Lord don't get me started on this....

[mrbb]

I fully agree the whole world is off FAR off from what common sense shoudl make simple!
THE good OLD USA< is the only Country that has an over populated death row??
HUMM< lets see, average death row inmate(last I seen data) costs like 90K a yr to keep! THAT"S for each one , and there are thousands of them, , ON DEATH ROW waiting to be killed for there crimes, they were found GUILTY of in OUR legal ssystem we use for all THINGS!
LOGIC says there is a simple solution to this problem, and ITS NOT letting them out, or giving them lower punishments to place them else where!

I don't care what ANYONE wants to tell me about HOW fear doesn't prevent things from happening, thats all tree hugging crap in my eye's
TWO things motivate humans in todays world, FEAR and MONEY
make folks fear something and 99% WON"T do it, PAY enouigh money and people will do about any thing!

we NOW live in a world where the guilty have too many rights, too many repeat criminals don't FEAR the legal system, or the punishments given, to STOP doing them! they figured it out, JAIL isn't that bad!
people ion Jail live better than , SADLY than many elders on fixed incomes, that never did a crime in there life and never did anything but work and can barely get by in the USA!
VETS come o=home and are on the streets, when INMATES get top line heath care on the tax payers dollars
its BULLCRAP
and sadly I never see it changing
NOT enought Americans will ever stand together anymore, its all WAY too much about ME today than others!
it starts at the leaders of this country
just think about it, WHO in there right MIND< spends more money to get elected, than the job pays!
if that doesns't say corrupt, what does!
any Goverment official that says they do the job to HELP the people, well, why don't they then do the job for free?
as they already spent so much to get the job they will never get back, and as such DON"T need the money the job pays
IF they are so called doing it for the country, do it, , let some hard working tax payers get a break!

yes this subjest is a hot one for I bet a LOT of americans

last, I think people should have to take parenting classes BY LAW if they want kids today!
cause kids today(NOT ALL)< seem to be lacking, and if the future is ever going to change, it needs to be with KIDS to learn as kids right and wrong! to better the next generations!

[zachc]

You're absolutely right mrbb, those that are breaking the law do not fear or care about the law and for good reason. A large majority of the Ohio prison system is taken up not by murders but by drug dealers and people who are shooting at others...mostly between 18-25! They break the law and are only sentenced to 3-5 years, thwy make it to prison and already know a bunch of people there. They do their lil time and get out, go back to hanging around the same people they were before, can't get a job because they have a felony on their record, so whats a quick way to get money...sell more drugs or rob people with a gun. And the cycle starts all over!! And instead of the state giving them a whole lot of time they just give them another 3-5 years, big deal, I've already told you how today's Ohio prisons are run! You would be surprised about how many people walk off the bus into a prison, see their "dudes" that are already locked up, hug and "shake" hands and are happy to see each other. Its like they are saying "yeah man I finally made it to prison, now I'm somebody!" I don't know about you but if, heaven forbid cuz it can happen to anyone in reality, I had to go to prison and I saw someone come in after me that I knew I would slap them in the face and say what the hell man! It seems like the state is taking no progressive steps towards rehabilitating these people. And another thing I can tell you, the state will do about anything for a dollar. Any program that we can get money from, sure we'll put it into the prisons. Do we care if it brings in several different "civilians" in and out of the prisons...nope! They would never bring any contraband in right, hahaha. And man you wouldn't believe the amount of these "programs" that are running, just another way inmates can pass contraband from one person to the next. Anyways I'll leave it at that for now...

[mrbb]

zachc, your right too, ONLY its not just in Ohio, its a across the USA this crap in prisions
the lure of easy money is hard for so many to pass up, 1,000 % mark up on illegal drugs is mad money in short order
BUT It always makes me wonder
who is buying all these drugs, as we can all blame the dryg dealers
BUT there wouldn't be so many dealers IF so many folks didn't want the drugs
I personally never have even once tried an illegal drug, and honestly have no desire to, or feel a need to, I have enough issues NOT on any drugs LOL
my wld sides has been way out there all my life couldn't imagine what would happen if I crossed that line too LOL

BUT all the crime we have to me is a percentage game based on human populations
if we had say 18% crime, 50 yrs ago, we had "X" amount of folks going to jails daily, NOW we have a population od a SO many more people, we still might ONLY have the same :X18% pf folks, just the 18% now is a LOT more people. again due to just more people in the world
and it makes things seem like there are SO many more bad folks, when MYABE its just there are more people in total, and the same % of bad ones
I can surely agree the system we have isn't slowing the numbers down IMO, and with the economy failing as much, I think % will ONLY get higher NOT lower, as folks that canbnot afford things are out of options , tend to break rules to get by more often!

NO one likes to hear this, BUT what has always helped curb things through out time has been LARGE wars with LARGE Numbers of folks dying!
sure I agree NO one wants to die, or see l.oved one die
BUT for generations war was what kept many things in spec, and also, after every war, and I mean war not conflict(yes folks die in the recent conflicts BUT not on the level big wars did)
after every BIG war the whole world advanced and econmy's boosted
50 yurs + without a major war, and what's happened the world wide web, cell phones?? park assist in cars??
sure good things, BUT look at all the bad, the whole world is in debt, billions living below poverty levels, and more every day!
polution at rates we never seen and resourses being used faster than ever
I'm not promoting war here, I'm just saying histpry has show things that happened after wars, that cannot be changed!

[zachc]

Very true mrbb! These damn people stop supporting the drug dealers, drug dealers will have to find other ways to make money. Granted that may be another way of breaking the law but maybe just maybe they would do something legal, lol. If smoking pot (and using other drugs) wasn't glorified by TV and music and media, then I think it wouldn't be the "cool" thing to do. Like you I have also never used illegal drugs, despite being around them a fair bit when I was in high school, at several big concerts, etc. Just never had the desire I guess. And especially don't now that I have a few kiddos and a blessed life to live.

One more thing, I forgot to bring up...prison only makes you a criminal! Think about it, you go to prison for a couple years for...whatever...your family and friends don't send you any money. Well you need to buy hygiene, envelopes for writing letters home, food, etc. Well you have no money so how are you gonna buy the stuff you need, well you are either gonna come up with a hustle (running a store out of your cell, shooting tattoos which is against the rules, selling various things like drawings or things you make, basically anything that you can do for "money" that others need, all of which are also against the rules of the prison) or you are going to steal or rob or beat up someone else to get what you need. On the flip side to that, there is actually a lot of wasted talent floating around the prison system. Some of these guys can really shoot good tattoos, draw and paint like no others, and come up with ideals to do different things (some may call it jerry riggin, lol) that its crazy. Its a shame that instead of using these skills and making an honest living, they would rather make poor choices and waste years or the rest of their lives in prison...

[mrbb]

well there are many un solvable issue today, sadly many good things might make the world worse off.
IF they stopped illegal drugs and dealing, the worlds economic's would crash. sadly that is, its a HUGE global business anymore, and think of all the jobs that would go under.
NOT siggestion its good we have illegal drugs. just its at a point now where I see no stopping it , in any good way. BUT a slow down kind of way. and I doubt that will ever happen. its fact that poor people tend to be the users of drugs. and as the poor populations keep growing, so will drug use.

as for prision making criminals, but it also make honest americans part of that problem.
as when a person gets out of jail after 10 or more(or less) yrs. and they have no job/income. who pays for this? average americans, we support them in prision and then out, criminals have figured out they can get by, due to the system in place.
once one has been in jail a few times, they don't seem to care about jail, or view jail as a bad place.
they learned to use the system, they get paid in jail, supported when they get out, and live better than many american that have PRIDE still, something I think most prisioners don't have.
many non criminal americans live in proverty, because of all the taxes we have to pay. supporting criminals at times, and all the jobs to contain them and try to stop and deter crime.
think about it.
drugs and crimes drug related are HUGE costs, and the sad part again, is without these crimes, the worlds economic's would these days crash? talk about a double edge sword??
no winning here, best I think, is to make death row room by following up on them punishments, and maybe, the fear of them crimes that get you killed will deter some from doing them, TEACH kids better, better education, better choices, maybe, MAYBE can be made then too
other wise, its a never ending deal that will only snowball into bigger costs to all:

[zachc]

http://m.wlwt.com/news/exclusive-video-double-murder-suspects-dramatic-arrest-caught-on-camera/32430574

Not sure if anyone else saw this video but j saw it on the news last night and couldn't help but think of this post. Although its slightly off topic, close enough. I went 0-60 when I saw it! This police officer is attempting to apprehend a double murder suspect and this is what happens? He had every right under the sun to put 2 to the chest and 1 to the head on this guy but instead...IMO...this officer is SO scared to death that if he shoots this guy his life will be ruined. He will he the next police officer all over national news being accused of excessive force because he shot and killed and "innocent" man. His family will be under the microscope about every little thing they do. The second he steps out of the car this suspect charges at him, and continues to drive him back away from his car. All this time he can be clearly heard ordering the suspect to stop, get your hands out of your pocket, etc. Says he doesnt want to shoot him but it doesn't stop the guy. Matter of fact the guy charges him again and either knocks him down or he falls, either way the police officer still does not shoot him...and why not???

Because the media blows these incidents way out of proportion! This guy is already a suspect in a double murder, and he had 100+ opportunities to pull out a gun/knife and do some harm to this officer, wtf!

[mrbb]

I think I am glad I am NOT a cop in todays world, of everything being on Video it seems
just opens the door to law suits, to waste more of the publics , wait TAX payers money(as we all know there are MANY that dopn't pay taxes)
I mean come on, crooks criminals, have WAY too many rights if you ask me, and personally at times I wish cops woulld shoot m ore of them LOL and save us all the trouble of paying for court costs
I mean there are many open and shut cases out there today, criminals want to fight the cops, then cops should use FORCE, , as NOT showing force just IMO< mean less criminals care about being caught!
I'm NOT saying cops should be judge and jury, but come on, you walk into a roomm with some a$$ raping a kid or??
do us all a favor and shoot that SOB< is my take. don't care if folks don't like it
some crimes should have punishments to meet what was done!

several of my friends that were cops for 30+ yrs all recentkly retired due to the risks they now face, as its NOT just being sued on the job, , once a suit is brought up, on the job, when they retire, it turns into a law suit against them off the force t5oo, which costs them out of pocket funds, CRAZY< found innocent in one court, then can be sued again when your NO longer a cop, is crazy, but sadly the way of the modern world
COPs are just humans, we all make mistakes, but there doing a job MOST folks don't want, or cannot do. its a shame they get so, drilled by media when a poor judgement call MIGHT happen
like to see how many others would react when you only have secondss to make a decision?

[zachc]

So back on this thread...I am watching the news right now and they just had a very infuriating story on. They showed surveillance video of 2 younger/middle aged males walk into a church entrance, there is an old lady standing there by herself (60-70), they walk up behind her, one snatches her purse and when she turns to look to see what is going in, the other one sucker punches her in the face and knocks her down and maybe out! Now its one thing to snatch an old lady's purse but really...punch her in the face??? What kind of POS are you? In a perfect world these 2 would be caught and punished severally. But in reality, if they catch them, which I'm sure they prolly will due to the quality of the video, one will get hit with robbery and the other aggravated assault and both will do maybe a year in prison! If they do much more than a day over I will be very surprised! And this isn't just me guessing, its fact, look some of these cases up. The s**t is out of control people....

[mrbb]

zachc, I fully agree with you, the punishment will NOT fit the crime they did, and odds are they might NOT even see ANY jail time, beside being held for the court case IF it even gets to court
SO many things are lower to SPEED things up for workers, that the criminals are the REAL people benefiting

the system we have now is degrading to the oint IMO< its NOT deterring anyone but the honest people from doing crimes
and these Honest people, are NOT the problem in the USA .
its a slippery slope, But I think some crimes(like this one), the e should be some way a judge can add extra punishments to certain crimes, based on what the FACTS are

SO many folks want to say punishment fear doesn't stop crime, BUT I still say BULL crap to that
FEAR is one of IF NOT the strongest emotion we all have, will make you do amazing things, both GOOD and BAD
it plain out motivates! not nothing else
except MAYBE MONEY!

SO< when the punishments don't cause enough folks to fear them, they have NO real reason NOT to cross certain lines

humans when left to decide on there own, tend to fail more times than NOT
Sad but true
its WHY we have laws!

[zachc]

Don't think I could agree more mrbb! Fear is an amazing thing! I'm not saying that American's should fear the government, local state or higher, but IMO society should know that "hey if I make this stupid choice and I get caught, I'm going to pay severely (one way or another)" well that definitely won't stop all crime but it WILL dramatically slow it down. Especially if the public sees the results of the punishment. Right now I think people think "Oh yeah, they caught the person/people, they're gonna get what they deserve" but again in reality, they get nowhere near what they should! Not going to repeat what I've already said as far as that goes but yeah. Also have to agree, the honest people this would not really affect. Now we all make some dumb choices at one point in our lives but for the most part I think the majority of society outgrows that part of their lives relatively quickly and have no more major problems (on average). But it seems like the ones that stay in that rut and decide to make that a way of life for themselves, that's the problem!
Sure everyone has heard about the Ohio mother who's killed her 3 sons over the last year? Really lady, really??? 3 innocent children that have never done a thing wrong and you decide that their loves should be ended! What a piece! Another story tonight, multiple teenagers (girls and boys) and a 23 year old, they said man but obviously boy, jumped another teen and was stomping his head and face and then stole some stuff from him. I think they said they had the guy and 4 teens. Well how about those kids and the one "man" get taking to the streets and get their faces kicked for awhile...bet the next group of teens that think about doing it will think twice and prolly not do it. Or maybe the family of the kid who got stomped gets to do it? Just saying. I know its easier said than done but come on America seriously! Is this what we've come to, all these senseless crimes and the individuals who do them aren't really even punished for them.... And when I say that, I'm prolly not talking to anyone on this site cuz normally folks that are into the outdoors and hunting are the good ole Americans that should be running this country...that our young and old men and women are fighting for everyday! And yet another reason to get our children into the outdoors whether it be hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, etc. Sheesh!

[mrbb]

I agree, and I'm NO angel
there is a gray area in life we all go to from time to time I think, and there there is a line that honest folks don't cross, because they have PRIDE< or fear or, just plain don't want the hassle IF they get caught

the world today is weak, far too many people expect others to stop bad things from happening to them, expect cops and teachers to show folks right and wrong, and its NOT there jobs
I don't know the details in all the latest cop shootings or claim to
BUT what I do know, or expect is true, the folks that got shot, odds are they were breaking the lawe to get contacted BY the cops
don't want to get shot by a cop, DON"T break the law
rather simple to me??
doesn't have to be a major things folks
doesn't have to involve law suits and media coverage and blah blah blah

and that's a HUGE problem, new today is about RATINGS< they want to make small things into world wide cover story's so the tv company's can MAKE money off others suffering!
its ad, people in grief get hammered by camera's and reporter who NEED to know how they feel
COME on, some just lost there house, kid, wife, father. and you cannot wait to stick a camera in there face and ASK< HOW do you feel
what are they stupid?? can't people GUESS how they feel?
when id suffering become ratings??
and that's also where the world is slipping, MOST people feed off others hard times
ever see how traffic slows to a crawl about an accident, people cannot mind there own business, and have to stare and take pictures of others mishaps
the world would be a MUCH better place if folks would mind there own business more than what they do

want to help a person in need, or a neighbor
JUST do, it, DON't get the media involved, or be you tubing crap

once I think there was pride in getting ahead doing more, NOW< IMO< it seems folks want to get ahead by others failing, or pointing out how other are NOT doing a GOOD job
its NO longer about LOOK at HOW good a job I'm doing
its about look how bad "X" is doing!!, taking the heat off there own ass to do less and look like they did something!

rewards in this word are backwards and getting worse!!

you tube is filled with video's of people doing things, that YRS ago, folks would be SO embarrassed IF anyone knew they did
NOW< folks cannot wait to show the world what they screwed up or did wrong!!
what happened to SHAME, or Pride??
Guess I'm too old for the modern worlds ways :LOL

[zachc]

Just wondering if anyone heard about the corrections officer who was taken hostage Sunday (10/18) at Mansfield Correctional Institution? Yeah I didn't think anyone did! Unless you live around the area you prolly had no clue. I watch the news usually twice a day and I never saw it once.

Long story short, 2 CO's were working in the library full of inmates. 1 of them got pulled out to work in the chapel, leaving the female CO in the library by herself (which honestly isn't that uncommon anymore). An inmate doing a life sentence for multiple charges, including aggravated murder (of 2 females) was classified as a library clerk working in the library, decided that he wanted to take the female CO hostage and lock her and himself in a small closet in the library. Again short version, this standoff lasted for about 10 1/2 hours! Reports ay the CO was not hurt, except some bumps and bruises. They finally blew the door and went in and extracted the inmate after 10 1/2 hours.

So my point to this post is...when an inmate takes a CO hostage for 10 1/2 hours at a prison, the public does not hear about it. But...when a CO or police officer puts hand on an inmate/civilian on the streets, its EVERYWHERE!!! There are videos all over the news and online! When in reality, the CO/police officer is just doing there job and trying to control the situation (in most cases). The public doesn't realize what goes on behind prison walls, inmates are not locked up for being good law abiding citizens who like to follow rules and regulations. Most of them are there because they have no respect for the law and law enforcement officers. So if they are not going to abide by the laws on the streets why would they follow them in prison??? Now I fully understand that there are plenty of situations that excessive/unnecessary force is used and I'm definitely not saying that that is right by any means. But on the same note, there are times when force HAS to be used. Also, when force is used most of the public is all up in arms because law enforcement is abusing their authority and thinking that they can do whatever they want, that poor guy didn't do anything to deserve that. I mean he only broke the law and is actively resisting arrest, you shouldn't use force on him! Yeah right!! But when that guy/girl breaks into your house at 3 I. The morning and points a gun in your face along with your spouse and children, robs you, and heaven forbid does some unspeakable things, how will you feel about that guy then? When your at the park watching your kids play and enjoy some time with their friends, and this random guy walks up and touches them, how will you feel about that guy then? When that same guy tries to lure them into a car so he can drive off with them and you never see them again, how will toy feel about that guy then? Or maybe when you and your family are walking down the street or eating dinner, gunshots ring out, when its over you look over to see your entire family lying in pools of blood lifeless...all because some a**hole was shooting at someone behind you that was his competition drug dealer and you were just in the way, how will you feel about that guy then? These scenarios sound crazy and "oh that would never happen to me" but anymore, sadly to say, it happens everyday throughout America. Most of the public wants inmates to be treated so nicely and fairly but what they don't think about is that guy prolly did at least one of those things and if it wasn't for the police officer who arrested him and the CO that is keeping him behind bars, he would be walking the streets doing the same things over and over. These days a LOT of people are anti-police but I think they fail to realize that if we did not have police officers patrolling the streets, the country would be complete chaos! Also these people are so anti-police but when that guy breaks in your house while your at work or grocery shopping or wherever and robs you blind, who do they turn to and expect to catch that guy...THE POLICE! Again not saying excessive force is right. Just another thing to think about....

[zachc]

I know that was a lot to read and if you don't read it all you should at least read the first 2 paragraphs.

[mrbb]

Zachc
I am a firm believer in that JAIL SHOULD BE a PLACE NO one wants to go, inmates should be treated with a strong hand, put to work and WORK there ass's off while serving time, they should eb PAYING back the punblic for there crimes
NOT treated like guest in a hotel with 3 meals a day, TV< Movies, getting an education ON the TAX payers dime
its IMO the FACT repeat inmates DON"T MIND doing time in these jails, that IS part of WHY they keep doing crime
the fear of JAIL isn't what it once was!
YES yrs back when jails were meaner to inmates WE STILL had crime

BUT at least they endured more for there punishment, which I am all for!

the fact most jail crimes DON"T make TV, to me is a double edge sword, as I THINK far too many morons are impressionable by what they see on TV, and more likely to do something cause they seen it on TV
local news crews in my area are like cysts on society, they cannot wait for someone to suffer so they can blab about it on TV
Like YRS ago when they called some Lawyers Ambulance chasers, as they were just waiting for someone to get hurt, so they could sue to make a profit off someone's bad luck or??
this practice was one frowned on, and now its glorified??

I fully agree, people want human treatment of people that do wrong UNTIL it happens to them, then all of a sudden, things change and views alter!
the two biggest motivators in the world are FEAR and MONEY!
like it or not, its facts

when criminals don't fear getting put in jail they take bigger risks
and in todays world of EVERYTHING on video and TV
more morons want to join the ranks of getting head doing wrong!

[mossbergbryson]

These inmates live better than I do at times. When my money gets funny I don't get 3 hot meals a day and recreational time. I can't get a free college degree. I'm paying out the butt for student loans bc I ran out of money to complete my degree. They do need to make prison a place you'd rather die than go to. America is definitely soft bc people wanna be politically correct. It's like ole Hank Wiallams Jr said, "the preacher man said it's the ends of time."

[mrbb]

I think part of the problem today is lack of pride in one's self
as if you don't care about Owning anything and want to live off hand outs, you can get a LOT of free things, from grants to health care to housing to food to even MONEY

But the KEY here is you must not have pride to want your OWN things, as to qualify for many things you must have zero property more or less, NO bank accounts no savings
and MOST HONEST hard working adults WANT to have things they EARNED !
and as such that makes them NOT qualify for a lot of the things , many system abusers are willing to live without
and its created a LOT of people that don't have shame no more or pride in being able to say they GOT what they GOT from working for it
a HUGE shift in the way people view life any more
way too many want the easy hand out over earning anything any more IMO