Adjusting my sight pins???

[Cheif]

I recently switched back to the orginal sight that came with my PSE Stinger. I did have a Tru Glo sight on my bow but it seems to come loose too much and I am always adjusting the sight. However, this morning I went out set my 20 yard pin. Then went to set my 30 yard pin and it seems like they are too close together. The twenty is right on top of the thirty. I do not like them that close. I have trouble looking through to the target. Is there anything that I can do to change that.

[buckstalker17]

Short of turning the bow down the speeds of these new bows there isn't much diff in 20 and 30 pins. May be set the 30 to 35 on so on that's what I did.or like I had mentioned take a couple turn out of the limbs and slows it down a little you don't need 350ft per second to kill a deer at 50 yards. I'm not sure what poundage you are shooting I will give you a reference off my bow I have a z7 at 70 lbs I turned it down to 58 pounds still shoots 295fps I shot my deer last year at 49 yards clean pass through. Now sure if you are going to hunt elk ,caribou or buffalo you might want to turn up the heat. But to hunt deer it's not necessary so don't be afraid to turn it down a little to get the pin gap you want trust me it doesn't take but a few turns. I always be leaved the more power and more speed was better but I soon found out consistent shooting and comfort is way more important.

[mrbb]

well, I would agree you don't need 70+ lbs to kill a deer, having a flater shooting bow helps a lot more to miss guessing yardage, thus why they make top bows that have speed
to slow one down, is defeating the gains, and money you spent on a high end bow??
Not bashing anyone that does, hey its your choice how you set up your bow, and spend your money
the best way to have a clean sight picture is to , I guess go to a one sight set up, that you dial per yardage as need be, with a fast dial
many folks seem to like this set up just because of the cleaner sight picture and the fact that they can even add power to the glass len's, options, many have, to help both get a more precise aiming spot on a target/deer, and to help with fading eye's as we age, or even a prescription lens, for glass wearer's

having pin's close together , isn't all that bad a problem, means you have a flat shooting bow, which, baded on models made and prices, is what most bow guys seem to want
they do sell smaller pic's too, to help get less blockage when there close together too
and again, you can try making your pin's at different ranges, like 20-35-45-etc/
to provide a bigger gap if need be, but maybe a one sight set up is something to look into??
good luck

[buckstalker17]

I see what your saying mr bb what people sometimes dont realize is that when you turn the bow down you can shoot a smaller spline arrow which I turn will fly just as flat with the tech of these new generation bows And that it is less effected buy cross winds than the bigger heavier splined arrows.

[SKO]

I see what your saying mr bb what people don't realize is that when you turn the bow down you can shoot a smaller spline arrow which I turn will fly just as flat. And is less effected buy cross winds than the bigger heavier splined arrows. spine(or spline for you) has nothing to do with wind drift, its about surface area. heavier arrows buck the wind better that light ones. you have to reduce arrow diameter, not spine, to reduce wind drift.

[Big_Holla]

Cheif, to answer your question on pin gap, about the only thing you could do would be to decrease or increase your poundage to either increase the gap or eliminate the gap. Other options would be increase the weight of the arrow or decrease the weight, just making sure that your spine still fits the draw weight and length you are shooting. One question though, if they are that close perhaps you could use one pin only out to 30 yards? If so, see how much of a difference it makes from 30 to 10 yards and in between.

[Big_Holla]

Another thought, what diameter of pins are you using?? Perhaps a smaller diameter...say .010 would give you enough of a gap to satisfy you?

[mrbb]

Well I am no expert, but if my logic makes any sense to anyone else, if you shoot a hevier arrow at a heavier draw weight, and then you lower draw weight and go lighter arrow
what gain is there? It would some what balance it self out no??
Simple logic to me
PLus I would have to think going lighter arrow, you would loose KO, not saying all the KO a 70 lb bow makes is needed for a deer kill, just saying
to spend top $$$ of a top line bow, going through the trouble to make it slower and less powerful, seems to defeat the reason to buy top line bows, but again, its the shooters money to set up and buy what ever they want
as for wind drift, yes typically lighter objects are effected more, or works that way with bullets, more times tgan not
smaller vanes on arrows I think would help more with wind drift too!
and sorry if were off subject here

[buckstalker17]

Mrbb think of it like a 22 rifle say with 125gr of powder at 50 yards and it travels 1300 ft per second the you take away say 15 gr then you shoot a second time and this time it travels at 1250 ft ps would it not stand to reason that it would shoot low because its traveling at a slower rate. The. Turn around a put a lighter projectile in with the same 110 gr of powder then it would stand to reason that it will hit the same as your first shot. Just at lower ftps with the same accuracy he is wanting distance between his pins that's the only way he is going to get it he has to slow the bow down just a tad and he will still the same accuracy @300ft per second as he would at 350 ftps just traveling at a slower rate I'm not saying take it from 70- 30 lbs I'm saying like 70-65 66 I own a 70 lbs bow when I replace it I will never buy a 70 again you don't need it to kill deer. A 60 lbs bow shoots the same ftps as a 70. If you are a strong burly man then yea maybe the 70 would feel better but it does not travel any faster it just stores more kinetic energy(god let me spell that rite or ill get hit by spell check ) = more power but it does not travel any faster than a 60 with the same arrow

[SKO]

Mrbb think of it like a 22 rifle say with 125gr of powder at 50 yards and it travels 1300 ft per second the you take away say 15 gr then you shoot a second time and this time it travels at 1250 ft ps would it not stand to reason that it would shoot low because its traveling at a slower rate. The. Turn around a put a lighter projectile in with the same 110 gr of powder then it would stand to reason that it will hit the same as your first shot. Just at lower ftps with the same accuracy he is wanting distance between his pins that's the only way he is going to get it he has to slow the bow down just a tad and he will still the same accuracy @300ft per second as he would at 350 ftps just traveling at a slower rate I'm not saying take it from 70- 30 lbs I'm saying like 70-65 66 I own a 70 lbs bow when I replace it I will never buy a 70 again you don't need it to kill deer. A 60 lbs bow shoots the same ftps as a 70. If you are a strong burly man then yea maybe the 70 would feel better but it does not travel any faster it just stores more kinetic energy(god let me spell that rite or ill get hit by spell check ) = more power but it does not travel any faster than a 60 with the same arrow

A 60 really shoots the same as a 70 pound bow? You seriously posted that?
Congrats on spellin kinetic..impressive..:D:eek:

[buckstalker17]

A 60 really shoots the same as a 70 pound bow? You seriously posted that?
Congrats on spellin kinetic..impressive..:D:eek:
with a 30 inch arrow the z7 at 60lbs draw bow or a 70lbs draw bow shoot the the same ftps+or - a few ftps do your due diligence good sir

[mrbb]

Well again, if you slow bow, and then lighter arrow, your drop will be the same, as even you say, in your example, first shot, then after your example, it would hit same hole
thus, your gap wouldn't change, and all you did was lower draw weight, and lower KE of the arrow
so to be fair, I see your example as being a wash, and not changing anything really on drop down range!
I have shot 1,000 yrd matches for close to 25 yrs, so my logic goes more with guns
but again, if you adjust, compensate lighter arrow, to get same speeds as with heavier arrow, and higher draw weight, it to me would be a wash on drop
a 500 grain arrow at 350 as to a 400 grain arrow at 320, just crazy numbers
the drop down range would almost be the same, thus, pins shouldn't change?
only way I see to get pins farther apart, is again, smaller pins, or change there zero's, from like 20 to 25 yrs or 30, to like 35 to 40, and so on
the easiest and best solutions I say is a one pin sight you adjust for range?
then you do not have to maybe re tune your bow, all the more so if you like your current draw weight and set up/form
and I agree, 70 lbs is not needed for deer, or even bigger game, but like they say, dead is dead, bigger weapon or smaller, shoot what you like and have confidence in
and I am not trying to bash or turn this into a major debate, just asking and stating what I THINK, and just my opinion, and I am NO expert
so don't get all excited folks!

[SKO]

with a 30 inch arrow the z7 at 60lbs draw bow or a 70lbs draw bow shoot the the same ftps+or - a few ftps do your due diligence good sir

About 10-12 fps slower...thats not "the same" due dilligence done quite while ago..the real question is how much efficiency loss is there?

[buckstalker17]

and you be leave that it will travel the same ftps with a lighter arrow and less poundage i can't wait to show you how wrong you are on that we will just have to agree to dis agree,, now maybe a 22 wasnt the best example

[SKO]

and you be leave that it will travel the same ftps with a lighter arrow and less poundage i can't wait to show you how wrong you are on that we will just have to agree to dis agree,, now maybe a 22 wasnt the best exampleeffciency loss?

[buckstalker17]

effciency loss?

at what 70-100 yards ?????????????????????????? if he wants want to get any pin gap he has to slow down the bow down or hes is going to have to shoot a way heavy arrow from 30 and beyond point blank period and yes you lose efficiency when you turn a bow down but that dosent mean you accuracy yea he might have a problem dropping a cape buffalo at100 yards but your not going to do that at 70 lbs either

[hortontoter]

To clarify a little. Lets assume the lighter arrow at 50 pound pull leaves the bow at the same fps as the heavier arrow at 60 pound pull. The lighter arrow will lose speed faster than the heavier arrow downrange. Will it be enough trajectory to quibble over in the range of a bow and arrow, probably not. I'd say the best solution is one of three mentioned. Smaller diameter pins, longer gaps in sight in points or a single pin type of sight. I know little about bows, but I'm assuming that changing the weight would mean one would have to retune the bow completely.

[buckstalker17]

To clarify a little. Lets assume the lighter arrow at 50 pound pull leaves the bow at the same fps as the heavier arrow at 60 pound pull. The lighter arrow will lose speed faster than the heavier arrow downrange. Will it be enough trajectory to quibble over in the range of a bow and arrow, probably not. I'd say the best solution is one of three mentioned. Smaller diameter pins, longer gaps in sight in points or a single pin type of sight. I know little about bows, but I'm assuming that changing the weight would mean one would have to retune the bow completely.
exactly !!!!!!!!! someone finally gets it thus leaving him to have to drop his pin down at 30 yards and beyond

[hortontoter]

And you guys thought I only knew about crossbows.

And kinetic energy has little to do with killing when it comes to archery. Hemmorage or lack there of is the key element.

[buckstalker17]

And you guys thought I only knew about crossbows.

And kinetic energy has little to do with killing when it comes to archery. Hemmorage or lack there of is the key element.

hey i knew i liked for a reason and i never thought that either lets just hope this cat dont attack you to i could be that he don't like me and i know you know your bait tackle also wont go to war with you on that

[hortontoter]

No worry, I've been attacked by the best of them. Most times I just sit back and feed them the rope. They almost always hang themselves eventually. You can usually tell in a couple posts if one knows what he or she is talking about.

[mrbb]

well I think the folks on this site this time of yr all have thicker skin LOL
all the softer folks maybe only show up come hunting season , when they have numbers to stand behind HAHA!
and to think indians killed game with rock on sticks for arrows! us in the carbon fiber optic age of archery gear!
and Hortontoter, I guess another option would be to go to instinctive shooting without sights too,
all the gap and or draw weight arrow weight a hunter can ever want then !! HAHA!

[buckstalker17]

well I think the folks on this site this time of yr all have thicker skin LOL
all the softer folks maybe only show up come hunting season , when they have numbers to stand behind HAHA!
and to think indians killed game with rock on sticks for arrows! us in the carbon fiber optic age of archery gear!
and Hortontoter, I guess another option would be to go to instinctive shooting without sights too,
all the gap and or draw weight arrow weight a hunter can ever want then !! HAHA!

I do agree with you on this.

[mneal]

I am by no means an expert... but in my estimation, this is a good problem to have. My Mathews Outback at 70 lbs shoots relatively flat to 28 yds. even though it was sighted in at 20. This means that for 90% of my shots... I only need one pin. I have done exactly what MrBB suggested and my second pin is dialed in from 28-35 yds... which ratchets me up to about 95% of my shots. I removed my fourth pin as I won't likely take a shot any further than 41 yds. (my third pin). I would consider this as customizing your site pins to match the trajectory of your arrows at a given draw weight... which ideally has also been customized based on your size, strength, and shooting preferences. There is no rule that site pins must be aligned in 10yd increments... I believe that is only a custom that has now become antiquated because of modern archery technology. Good Hunting!

[hortontoter]

Now that makes a lot of sense. Great idea.

[Big_Holla]

I am by no means an expert... but in my estimation, this is a good problem to have. My Mathews Outback at 70 lbs shoots relatively flat to 28 yds. even though it was sighted in at 20. This means that for 90% of my shots... I only need one pin. I have done exactly what MrBB suggested and my second pin is dialed in from 28-35 yds... which ratchets me up to about 95% of my shots. I removed my fourth pin as I won't likely take a shot any further than 41 yds. (my third pin). I would consider this as customizing your site pins to match the trajectory of your arrows at a given draw weight... which ideally has also been customized based on your size, strength, and shooting preferences. There is no rule that site pins must be aligned in 10yd increments... I believe that is only a custom that has now become antiquated because of modern archery technology. Good Hunting!

You are completely right mneal, if they are too close then don't worry about even numbers when it comes to yardages. Use the first pin out to X distance max when sighted in at 20 to give you one pin that you find acceptable out to a known distance beyond 20. Note I said acceptable, that means you as the shooter and not anyone else's standards. The second pin can be any number you want after that and so on. Just have to keep it as simple as you can so it isn't confusing when you are taking that shot at a buck at 32 yards LOL!!

[buckstalker17]

You are 100% correct I had suggested that before we got way off topic there is no standard it's just more of common practice for whatever reason I'm sure that is a topic for another day. Hmmm my z7 shoots the same at 20-26 but I do use a single pin sight so I don't have a sight group problem but I have had said problem in the past with a different set up. But I also set a mark below my 60-65 that will me a clean shot at 10 yards and in if the need would arise but if I would switch to my hunting sights what I do is I find my true 20 yard range when it will not hit the target I come in 5 yards and set the pin and the same with the 30 that way i know I have a 5 yard overlap so if the deer steps out I range him and it says 27 yards I instantly know with out even thing about it 30 yard pin.

[00buck]

I have one pin out to 35 yards and then my arrows don't fly as flat and i shoot 5 pin tru glo sight looking to upgrade to different sight soon