Went shed hunting yesterday...Found 5 dead deer

[PlayTheWindMike]

Well as many of you know I take pride in my honey hole. I have taken a couple of our members along for a hunt or two...well yesterday I thought, I have not been there to shed hunt this year so I had to make the tough agonizing decision to stay at work or hit the woods and hitting the woods won. For the guys who have not seen pics of my hunting valley, it is one wooded thick and thin valley surrounded by a clover infested field and two other alfalfa fields, then the valley runs back into the woods and beyond....a couple of pics of the valley for your review. First two pics are half way through the valley on the top side, third pic is down in the bottom of the valley farthest point into the woods which is huntable....a rich doctor who would prefer to feed than kill wild animals which is fine with me...no hunters back in there behind my last pic here
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Now that we have the view out of the way. There is one spot which is the furthest northern part (no pic) of the valley before it ends into the alfalfa fields and the last 150 yards, about half of that is THICK. This is the area where the deer love to bed. Well I searched the entire property on foot, even along the fences separating fields, everywhere and did not find one horn. I was ok with that but it was strange is when I worked my way through the thickest stuff to get down in the open area of the thicket I found a massacre, I do not know what hit these deer, bones everywhere I looked. I was distraught and terribly confused. I immediately began my own investigation within my mind....all the bodies were there, all the heads were there except for one. Some together, some apart. I was piecing together bones to figure out how many deer here. Well I found 5 total, dead deer within a 13 yard area, yes I ranged it. I was devastated to find this and I still am. I have in my mind what I believe happened but not sure......maybe a pack of yotes got them surrounded, I just do not know. Would love to hear from you guys on this. These deer were not here the first week of January. I walked through this same spot at that time.

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[PlayTheWindMike]

More dead pics, it wouldn't allow me to post all the pics in the original thread post. here they are
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[Sully]

PTWM,
First of all it looks as though you have one heck of a nice huntin spot. You're very fortunate and I'm a little jealous.

As far as the dead deer go, by looking at the pics it appears to me that they were not all killed at the same time. The reason I say this is because the carcasses/bones are all in different stages decay. Some of the bones look older with green moss growing on them and no hair around them while in the last pic you can see hair all around the body including still attached to the flesh near the hoof.

Is it possible that this could be a neighbor or poacher dumping site?

If not, maybe an EHM outbreak?

It would take one huge pack of coyotes to take down 5 deer all at the same time in the same place.

Either way its a shame that happened, especially in your honey hole!

[SSpengSS]

One word. Yotes. Most deer head for water when hurt or ill, but that doesn't seem to be the case here. Coyotes are more capable than most give credit for, but I have seen it happen where I hunt. I have found piles of deer bones like that, among other critters. That is likely where they drag to feed.

I suppose it's possible someone may be piling poached deer there, but heads would be gone. Start hunting the yotes.

[SSpengSS]

2-3 weeks could easily yield that many deer from coyote kills if it is a larger pack.

[mrbb]

well I too don't think coyote's will group up enough tp bring down 5 deer that close to each other, and keep them there and kill all of them
thats a pretty big task
and if you had that many coyote in your area you would be finding a ton of dead der all over, and fwe live one's on your lands
NOT saying its impossible, just to me not likely
that being said
IF I had to guess , I would almost say maybe someone poisoned them, lots of folks hate deer, and its not terrible uncommon to have a person feed them something bad
and that can even happen to folksd meaning good
corn can go bad, and actually kill a deer if they eat enough of moldy corn off a bait pile
and well, in winter deer do yard up(also a reason making a coyote kill being lower odds, they tard up for protection!)
so to me , I say thats a higher odds deal, they all ate together, maybe a family group, and all ate the bad food, and thus??
NOW EHD or something else is possible too, but normally again you find a lot more dead deer in the area
IF your good with your state game dept, you can call them and ask them, they might be able to test the remains?
or might even know of a neighbor that has a MAjor issue with deer/crop damage, and a dis ike of deer
odds are these folks have complained to the state many times before acting out!
that's my guess/suggestions
and sorry,
it sucks I am sure

[SSpengSS]

I just want to make sure that what I said was clear. I don't believe a large pack of coyotes cornered and killed 5 deer in one night.

However, it is very plausible that a pack of 3-5 coyotes killed 5 deer over the span of 2-3 weeks, especially in thick areas where deer can't escape as quickly. I see coyotes circle around deer to prey on all the time, and its a chore for the deer to get away unscathed, most especially when there are 2-3 coyotes hunting together. Much less january-march when coyotes are mating and need the protein to roam about in the cold snow and ice.

As far as natural causes, the above is what I believe happened. It is entirely possible that poaching/dumping/poisoning happened as well. If they were poisoned, I would suspect you should find dead coyotes, crows, vultures, opossums, racoons, etc. in the area as well.

I think we need to look at the impact of coyotes a little deeper. They are well ahead of wild hogs in terms of sheer numbers. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they are not there. It is not that common for me to get trail cam pics of coyotes, but each time I go coyote hunting I see no less than 4, and often more. One evening I saw 9 different coyotes in less than an hour and that covered about 200 acres that I could see. The area I hunt is surrounded by land untouched and very thick in areas just as mentioned in this scenario.

I just suggest you take a deeper look into your coyote numbers, that's all.

[mrbb]

well I would like to add, that , over the yrs I have known farmers that poisoned deer, and to be honest, other animals didn't really eat the bait like the deer did, if they ate moldy corn, a bird or other smaller animal might not eat as much as a deer would to impact it, and a bird might fly far a way before dying
I don't disagree coyotes will for sure kill more than one deer, but the odds of it being in the same spot to me is very evry odd, deer learn where bad spots are after a few things spoil an area
and to be honest I have the oppisite effect on coyote sightings
when i hunt them I see less than when I am deer hunting or in trail cam pois
last weekend I spent 34 hrs hunting them, and only seen two, one too small to shoot, and one big one but ran at the farmers house not giving me a safe shot!
it was a 2.5 day coyote contest, has 36 grand in the pot too!
so didn't get to kill a one!
there sure smart critters if my eye's

[Big_Holla]

From the pics that you posted I would say you have deer that died at different times/years. I know you said you were just through there recently in January, however the living and dying grass that's grown up around the spine in one picture and the mildew/moss growing on some other bones tell me they've been a while (like Sully's observations). Before I would go to any conspiracy theory of mass poisonings I would look at the likely hood of you having a case of EHD at some point with the possibility of a yote kill there on the skeleton with the rib cage still intact. I would venture to say though, that one likely was during the fall as there is no sign of hide even left, perhaps a hunter's kill that got dumped and perhaps drug to the bottom. How far away from water/stream would these be??

[PlayTheWindMike]

Well all is good observations. Gives me a little insight. Holla this is location about 50 maybe 60 yards from that stream. After reviewing now, yes they do look like they are from different times (maybe 3 time frames). My thoughts are no one purposely poisoned these deer. In the pic of stream, I said the land behind me was huntable......I meant it is not huntable. That is the drs land behind me and he loves deer, he might even have them named. Then the farmers, not in them to do anything purposely. This entire block is a few miles distance around this block. The farmers outside of this block, the other side of the road let their buddies and myself if I wanted to hunt but like I said in earlier threads, there are only two or three small plots within this block who are allowed to hunt the small 5 to 10 acre plots. There is approximately ahhh 400 acres on the block. Where this valley is, right behind my friends house, the dead deer, 25 yards from his back yard line, if a poacher was dropping, it would not be there. He would have to come in from the back side which is a couple thousand yards or so. more so. Drop point, definitely ruled out. EHD I don't know. I am starting to believe that yotes are the cause. They are around there. One or two of these deer could have been wounded and this is a spot that the deer absolutely love and ran there. I have in the last 4 years I have stalked the valley and shot at 3 bedding monster bucks all well over 150 right at the very spot where these bones are. The beds are are thick here. I think I might learn the ins and outs of yote hunting and may go give it a try. I have found dead deer 500 yards off the road back in that the back quarter were being eaten and the deer gone the next day. 100% yote kills. Any experts on yote hunting?

[Big_Holla]

Very possible yotes have drug one or two of them there too. My buddy placed his deer carcass out to try to shoot a yote that was hanging around. The whole carcass is no where to be found now and we plan to look for it when we do some shed hunting. Thinking it likely was drug off and down into the bottoms.

[mrbb]

well in my post from last week or so, I found 4 dead skulls , and where they were for sure I believe something carried them there
and just didn't die there for sure, as the racks had been cut off, and it wasn't a place easy to drop a head or a carcass off at
some critters I think carry things to places they like to bed maybe or den close by
but I still lean to something got them sick, and killed them
might not have been from a person trying to kill them either, moldy corn is toxic so??

[SSpengSS]

Hey playthewindmike, check my coyote hunting tips and tricks thread on the predator hunting category. That should get you started. Not sure where you're at, but I would help you out if you'd like.

I've had deer bed down in front of me and have watched coyotes circle and close in on them so many times it's not even funny. Almost every morning when the turkeys flew down from their roost this fall and winter I would have no less than 3 yotes closing in on them. They are stone cold predators.

Do you see a bunch of racoons, groundhogs, opossums, or rabbits on this property? As many as you think you should? I used to see a ton of those critters on the property I hunt until I noticed increases in yote numbers. I then started noticing more deer remains.

A lot of people/hunters think that coyote numbers aren't that bad, and maybe in their areas they are not. Each area, even if it's 50 acres, has it's own wildlife distribution and sustainability. Also, the old-school thought is that coyotes are needed for the circle of life, and I agree that they are. However, when the easy, little critters start disappearing and there are increasing numbers of coyotes (since humans and other coyotes are their only predator risk) those coyotes still need to eat, and they will pack together and kill deer. That's just a fact.

I've attached a pic of a yote my uncle shot yesterday morning. He had 5 come in to the call but could only get one shot off. Tell me that 5 of these apex predators, who have superior senses, even better than deer, can't do serious damage on any critter you've seen in the woods.

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[mrbb]

hey just something to think about
we all know deer like minerals
and well many DOT depts use salt and salt like mineals and chemicals to spray roads in winter?
ever wonder what effect it has on deer that either lick them, or eat plants and like that get residual spray on them or out right eating the salt that spills into piles??
just a something to think about maybe!

a good way I always used on coyote, is to keep tabs on there poop?
if there eating a lot of deer you will see a lot of deer hair in it!
same as for other critters, but deer hair shows up a lot in what I find in many areas, so I know they live on a lot of deer1

[PlayTheWindMike]

Good stuff guys. Speng I will hit you up later maybe we go check out and try to kill some yotes.

My last day of work here, I resigned. I have planned this, to start my own business and work full time for myself so I will have more time for outdoors.

Going in a couple hours, loading my quads and picking up a couple buds to hit the southern Ohio woods this weekend. Shed hunting mostly. All have a good weekend

[Big_Holla]

Very nice!! Congrats on the new endeavors!!

[SSpengSS]

I'll be looking forward to hearing from you! And congrats on starting your own business, that's exciting stuff and wish you good luck!

[blackbeard]

Definitely that time of year to find dead ones, I found 3 different dead ones on my property last weekend, pretty sure one was a doe I hit late in the season, other two who knows, the Yotes eat everything but the bones and hair.